January 20th, 2021

Episode #7


Dr. Bruce Lipton Speaks Out About Psychedelics, Reprogramming Beliefs, Epigenetics &
Quantum Physics

Laura Dawn speaks with the author of Biology of Belief, Dr. Bruce Lipton, who shares his support for psychedelics for the first time ever publicly, claiming, “I wouldn’t be here today doing I’m doing if it wasn’t for psychedelics.”

To find that, quantum physics on one side and epigenetics on the other, are both saying the exact same thing. Our consciousness is manifesting this. Change your consciousness, and you change your reality.
Dr. Bruce Lipton


About This Episode:

For the first time ever, author of Biology of Belief, Dr. Bruce Lipton speaks publicly about his support for psychedelics, claiming: “I wouldn’t be here today doing what I’m doing, if it wasn’t for a psychedelics.” 

In this conversation, Bruce Lipton also touches on:

  • The body as a “virtual reality suit”
  • The true source of our identity and how psychedelics influence our perception of our identity
  • Epigenetics
  • Quantum physics and quantum field theory,
  • The root cause of our subconscious programming
  • Three techniques for reprogramming the subconscious mind
  • The difference between the conscious versus subconscious mind
  • Cymatics
  • His take on COVID and the role stress and fear are playing in the pandemic
  • Tips for boosting your immune system

Core Themes

Explored in this episode:
  • Epigenetics
  • Quantum physics
  • Subconscious reprogramming
  • Cymatics
  • The pandemic
  • Your immune system

Links &

useful resources

Episode Transcript

Episode #7: Bruce Lipton Psychedelic Leadership Podcast.

Duration: 01:57:33

Laura Dawn: Dr. Bruce Lipton, gosh, I have to say, this is such an honor to be having a conversation with you. I’ve been holding this vision for a number of years now. So this is just a testament to my own belief that prayers are powerful. So thank you for taking the time for this today and allowing this miracle to unfold in my own life.

Bruce Lipton: Laura. I am so honored to be your guest because you have an audience out there that involves cultural creatives, people thinking in a different way. And this is the only way to deal with the issues of today because it’s consciousness, that’s creating this reality. Uh, and unfortunately most of us have been programmed to be disempowered and then try to strive in a world where you already are given: “you’re not powerful.” And then it’s like, Oh my God. Behind the eight ball hasn’t even started yet. 

Laura Dawn: Okay. So I’d love to just dive right in and just to set the context for this first question, there’s a very commonly held belief in the psychedelic community, especially amongst professional practitioners that these substances help us access our subconscious minds.

Which is why psychedelic-assisted psychotherapy is becoming much more prominent in our healthcare system. And I personally hold this viewpoint that psychedelics and plant medicines can be one modality. I know you talk a lot about different modalities and we could touch on that at some point, but I think a lot of people are seeking psychedelic therapy because of a desire to heal a past trauma, or they feel stuck, or because they want to change some aspects of themselves, behavioral or otherwise.

And I think you have an interesting piece that could be valuable to a lot of people who are actively going deep and seeking out altered states of consciousness for a variety of reasons. But one large reason is to make contact with the subconscious mind and uncover some of those root programs that are running the show.

So for listeners, just to be clear, Bruce is not advocating the use of psychedelics. We’re actually not going to be talking about psychedelics at all throughout this show, but it’s to explore how this body of knowledge can be beneficial for those of us who are choosing this path and modality of healing.

And Bruce, as I’ve journeyed throughout the years, and I’ve, as I’ve learned your piece around understanding the way subconscious imprinting happens. Um, it’s actually been a beneficial body of information to go into these altered states of consciousness with. So I feel like this is the most appropriate place to start at the beginning, which according to some might be the moment we’re born, but maybe we can even go further back and explore the role our ancestors even have in shaping who we are today.

And just start by talking about the imprinting that’s happening in the subconscious realms in those formative years. 

Bruce Lipton: Well, there are so many things to go here with. Number one, I really believe that the psychedelics played the most important part because they disconnect us from the subconscious to give us a perspective of where we are outside of ourselves, looking back.

So it’s almost like a third party view of yourself. And then all of a sudden the clarity and, uh, uh, I’ve been in a place a number of times where, uh, life has all of a sudden like, Ooh, and then I step outside and look at it and there’s a peace and calm. To see it from the outside rather than caught, caught up in all the chemistry emotions and all that stuff on the inside.

So psychedelics do offer this opportunity to say you are more. Then this physical realm right here, uh, and of course, historically it’s been used, uh, in cultures all over the planet as a coming of age that says, let, let me now have an opportunity to let you see who you really are. You are the energy, the field the spirit and all that.

The body is like a virtual reality suit that we come into and, uh, each person is different. And I say that from a biological point of view, very simply based on the factors, this, if I take my cells and put it into your body, your immune system will say “not self” and get rid of it. You take your cells, put it in anybody else’s body, their immune system not self, get rid of it.

So all of a sudden there’s a very important point. It says there’s an identity in your cells that if somebody else’s immune system can read and say, that’s not me, that’s somebody else. And I say, well, where are, what is this identity? Well, it turns out on the surface of our cells, our protein antennas, just like a television.

And there’s a group of them. No two people have the same set of these antennas. They’re called interestingly enough, even before they understood it, they gave it the name that is most appropriate. These antennas are called “self receptors”. Well, receptor means receiver. Okay. Uh, in the Newtonian world, they said, Oh no, the self is because of these different proteins.

And I go, no, you see, in the world of quantum physics, it’s the signal received by these receptors. That is the source. And I go, well, why is it relevant? And the answer is this: our identity, no two people have the same set of receptors. So. Every person is receiving a different broadcast, so to speak.

It’s sort of like a, you have a radio, uh, and there’s a lot of stations on it and that’s like, let’s say the FM band or the AM band. Well, let’s say we’re on the human band and that as you move the dial and go down the band, there’s the station and station and the station as you go down. Each of us has a station on the giant human band.

Each of us is receiving our own broadcast. That makes us unique yet all of us came from the same band, the same source. So there’s a level of total connection. And when we come in here as like a separation, I’m only looking at my station. And then you just see the Bruce show right here, going on like that.

Well, when I really understood the nature of this and the role of quantum physics, the first thing that hit me as a conventional scientist of the day, which was emphasizing DNA and proteins and cells and all that I said, Oh my God, my identity is not even in here. 

My identity is a broadcast being received by myself and to show the non-locality of that there are experiments where they take cells out of a person, put them in a Petri dish, and move that Petri dish a hundred miles away. And they have electrical recording of the electrical activity, sort of like EEG on a cell level. Uh, and they create a split-screen television with a cell activity, a hundred miles away.

And the person being here who donated those cells and what they showed, which is so like mind boggling is when this person had an emotional response. At exactly the same time, a hundred miles away, the cells revealed a higher energy activity and something happening. So it was connected. I go, yeah, but they’re a hundred miles apart and I go, yeah, because the local, the person identity isn’t in here. It’s received by here, just like a television set and the cells being a hundred miles away. That’s like part of a television set this over there with the same antennas, same station. And they respond at the same time. 

Most important reality for me was, Oh my God, we’re not even in here, we are an energy that comes into this and I have to admit that, uh, the moment of being a non-spiritual person, then, uh, understanding the mechanism with the antennas and the proteins and all that stuff.

And I was like, Oh my God. Oh, I’m not in here immediately. So wait a minute. I’m a broadcast. I’m an energy. And I go, why was it relevant? Well, you can call it a field. That’s what we call it in physics: an energy field, but a specific energy field I’m associated with a person who can get the name, spirit, same word, energy field, spirit.

I go. So why was that relevant for me? It was the biggest wake up call in my life because the first thing as a biologist, I sat there and I said, I can’t die. I’m not even in here. Uh, and, uh, and the relevance is yeah, the, the suit we call a body of virtual reality. So it’s like a television set. And my broadcast, Bruce shows up playing through this television set.

And if you’re watching a TV and the TV breaks, we say the TV’s is dead. But then I go on and say, well, wait, isn’t the broadcast still there? And the answer, of course it is. And I go wait, then that means my body can come and go. But my broadcast is always here. And that if a body in the future has the same set of antennas that are on my cell, I’m back.

But in a different TV, uh, and the beautiful part about it is It doesn’t make a difference if you’re male or female. Nope. That’s a TV set. Doesn’t make a difference: white, brown, black, yellow, red. I go, no, that’s a TV set. So we really have to disconnect ourselves from the TV that we’re currently in versus the broadcast that we really are.

And this becomes important because of this system. Who are we and why are we here and all that? And for me, the most exciting thing was, cause I asked myself being a scientist at the moment of like, Oh my God, I’m a spirit. And I’m a body. And my science brain goes, well, then why should I be a body? Why not just be the spirit?

And that’s when I found out it had a funny, uh, you humorous Jewish cells. Because when I asked the question: “Why have a body and a spirit?” My cells welled up with an answer that came right up from the 50 trillion cells into my head. Uh, and I asked them, why have both? And they asked me, Bruce, if you’re just a spirit, what does chocolate taste like?

And all of a sudden I said, Oh, my God, this is a wonderful mechanism. It translates the environment, energies into visual energy, sound energy, smell energy, taste energy, feeling energy inside, whether it’s love or fear or all that. Uh, this is a virtual reality suit. And, and so at some point, I, I said, wait a minute.

I’m a spirit; spirits here all the time. But when my, when I have a suit, that’s tuned to my spirit, I can play. And I say, not only do I have that chance to say, what is chocolate tastes like and have a chemical understanding of it, but I can also direct a suit to go here or to go there or to do this and create an all of a sudden, I said, Oh my God, we came here to create.

And I go, what did we come to create? And I said, well, we all with our wishes and desires came here to create what happened. And I go, that was the coolest part because I said, wait a minute, you don’t die and go to heaven. You’re born into heaven. This is an extension of our spirit by having this it’s greater than just a spirit.

And we came here to create and to experience and to feel. And all of a sudden, my whole life changed. And  I said, Oh my God, people think you die. And then you go to heaven and I go, Oh my God, it’s just the opposite. You were born here. And we came here to create, and Laura, you know, this really fits into your program of, well, what the heck are we creating?

And if it’s heaven, how come it looks like this out the window, because it’s sure as heck doesn’t look like heaven. Well, there’s a whole connection of what happens between the spirit and the manifestation. 

Laura Dawn: Right. Right. Well, maybe I could just pause you for a second because I’m curious your perspective on this because yeah, I love the perceptual shift that we are born into heaven on earth, and yet, for so many people right now, a lot of people are struggling right now from past traumas, from finding it really hard to change deeply ingrained behavioral patterns. So maybe we could just start there for a second. You know, how does the subconscious programming happen as children and why is it so hard for us to overcome that programming?

Bruce Lipton: Okay. Number one, the brain is recognized by everybody, including biologists to be a supercomputer. It is a computer and it has all the characteristics of a computer. So let me just talk about a Silicon based computer, like the one we’re talking on right now, and I go, you could go to the store and you can buy a computer and you take it home.

And there’s a button, like a start button and it boots up. The screens on. I go, great. I say, now do something. Yep. I can’t do anything yet. Why not? Well, before you just bought this new computer, you can’t make a spreadsheet or a drawing or write an essay you need to first put in a program. And then that program is then what we can then use to interface the computer.

Okay. Well, this is exactly true for the brain of a child and the last trimester of pregnancy. It’s booted up now, what? It can’t do anything until what? It downloads programs! 

Where do the programs come from? And the answer is that, uh, an infant, just even before you’re born, uh, and through age seven, the brain of a child is not operating in what we call consciousness as a predominant state.

The predominant state of a child’s brain at that age is theta. And I thought that’s when you put wires on a person’s head and read their, their brain function, and it’s got vibrational levels and theta is a vibration lower than consciousness. 

The sequence is the lowest vibration is Delta sleeping and then theta, which is characterized as imagination followed by the next higher level alpha, which has calm consciousness, followed by the next higher level called beta, which is like schoolroom consciousness. When a child is born, it doesn’t have a whole range of activity. First of all, it doesn’t even have any programs.

So the first seven years, the brain’s predominant activity, is theta, characterized by imagination. Just to give a point, uh, um, there’s a tea party and the kids pour nothing into the cup and then drink the cup and exclaim how that was the most wonderful tea I ever had! 

That’s theta in operation. Okay. I go, okay.

So theta, childhood mixing real-world and imagination, but functionally, theta is hypnosis. And I go, why should I have hypnosis? I said, how do you think you’d get a downloaded program? It’s not you creating a program. It’s a program that is downloaded into you by what? Observing other people. That is the basis.

I mean, think about how many rules it takes to be a functional member of a family or functional member of a community. There are rules, we’ve got to have these rules, otherwise you don’t fit. And I said, well, how do you understand the rules? You’re an infant. You can’t even read a book. How are you going to know?

And I go, you don’t have to that’s nature’s design. Theta hypnosis. Watch your mother, watch your father, watch your siblings, watch your community, download their behavior as fundamental programs, so that we can learn to be a member of a family community with nothing more than just observing the world for seven years.

Well, this is really cool because then after age seven, now that those programs are in consciousness can kick in and then utilize those programs. Okay. So I go, well, this is really good, except for the fact is most of the programs that we download by observing others are disempowering self-sabotaging and limiting beliefs.

And I go, well, what’s the problem with that. And I go, because if you’re going to use those programs, you’ve already compromised yourself because you didn’t get the correct programs. Okay. Uh, I’ll just give one. For example, uh, most people grew up in a family of somebody who’s not well, we go to the doctor, I go, well, what does that mean?

I say, watch a kid learn from zero to about seven. Anytime anybody’s sick. They go to the doctor. I say, what is the learning of this program? And the answer is I’m not in charge of my health. When it comes to health, I have to buy. The truth from the professional, the doctor. So all of a sudden, I say, I give up my control of my health to whatever the doctor says, because the program said, that’s the one who knows and you don’t.

So then whatever the doctor’s words are, diagnosis prognosis. Uh, we own that as a program, as that’s the true picture, not your belief. But whatever the doctors said. So you gave up your power. Okay. Well, this happens at so many levels of all this and I go, well, this is a problem. Uh, the programs that we got up to the 70% are disempowering self-sabotaging and limiting beliefs, such as the doctor controls my life.

I go, so why is this relevant? I go, well, that’s the program. Should we start with, but then I said, once we get consciousness, We can interface those programs and put our wishes and desires, conscious mind wishes and desires. That’s what the conscious mind is: the creative aspect of what it means to be human. What do you want out of your life?

You know, I said, Laura, tell me what you want. The answer comes from the creative conscious mind. That’s what makes us different than lower animals. We can take an idea and then manifest it. 

Okay. I go, well, that’s really great. And then I can go, but here’s the problem. So this connects to everything you’ve been involved with and all the people out there, including myself, is that consciousness, when driving the vehicle, look at, consider your body vehicle steering wheel. 

When consciousness has got its hands on the wheel, consciousness being creative wishes, desires, aspirations, where do you think consciousness is going to drive you to the resolution of wishes and desires? I go, that’s great. But then I go, Oh, when I say what you mean, I go consciousness can think.

You go, what the hell does that mean? So I say, um, I’ll give, uh, Laura a Little question here. Uh, I say, Laura, what are you doing on Sunday afternoon? Now the idea is if Laura doesn’t have anything written down in front of her telling her what she’s doing on Sunday afternoon, I know she’s going to give me an answer.

I said, where’d you get your answer from? I thought about it. I was thinking where I get it. And I go, wait a minute. Conscious mind when driving the vehicles, looking out the window. Driving to let’s go to where we want to go. But if I ask you a question, and consciousness doesn’t have to seek the answer. The answer is not out.

The answer is in her head. I said, so why is irrelevant? She redirects attention. Now attention is looking inside. What am I doing on Sunday? Start to consider it an all of a sudden, boom, the answer shows up. Great. And I say, what was the point? And this is the crux of our story today, Laura. And that is simply this. 

Well, when Laura’s consciousness was looking out the window and driving the vehicle, she was driving toward her destination where she wanted to go. But the moment she started thinking she had to let go of the steering wheel because her attention was no longer looking out. It was now looking in; thinking is insight.

I go, you mean you let go of the steering wheel? I mean, it’s interesting because most of us have done this. If you’ve been driving a car for a while, uh, when you get in the car and you start driving, you have a passenger, uh, and you’d have a wonderful conversation. And then you look out the window and go, I haven’t looked at the road for the last five minutes out, but hey, we’re still driving no accident.

Okay. We’re good. I go. And now I’ll ask you a question and this is pertinent, but if you get the answer and the question is this: “what were you talking about in the conversation?” You go, Oh, we were talking about this and this and this. I go, okay. Now comes the good question. What was on the road? And that five minutes you go.

I don’t know. I wasn’t looking well then who the hell was driving? And I go, subconscious is autopilot. Mm, what does that mean? Any function needed when the conscious, not paying attention, a function that we’ve learned, uh, we’ll automate basically play it’s a program. It’s a subconscious program and will just play that program.

And I go, so why was that relevant? And I go back and I say, okay, let’s go back. We got programmed. Yeah? Did the programs come from us? Nope. They came from watching others, mother, father, family, et cetera. And I go, okay. Did they answer your wishes and desires? Probably not. So I say, why is it relevant then?

How are you going to express your wishes and desires? When your programs don’t offer that you go, what? I’m going to stay conscious. I’m not going to think that’s being mindful. Okay. And that’s really cool, but it’s not likely to happen. Our world is so busy that thinking is unavoidable and science has recognized 95% of the day.

We are thinking. I go. So what’s the significance? 95% of the day, your life has been controlled by programs that didn’t come from you. I go, why is it relevant? Because then your life you’re manifesting isn’t from conscious creative wishes and desires. It’s from historical programming. I go, so why is that relevant?

Well, if those programs don’t support your life, then your life doesn’t really support your wishes and desires. But, now here comes the but, when we have no awareness of this, we started in the morning, like today, I’m gonna find my relationship today. I’m going to get healthy today. I’m going to do all these positive things and you go out and then you come home in the evening.

It’s like, it didn’t happen. Just didn’t happen today. And then I say, well, why not? And you go: it’s not me, because remember today I started with the wishes and desires. So the world, the universe is not supporting me. And I go, Oh God, let’s fix that right now. And I go, why? 

First important point, and then we’ll discuss it, and that is this: quantum physics is the most valid science on the planet. There is no science has been tested or affirm to be truer than quantum physics. So, uh, if you have the question of science, don’t question quantum physics yet, because it’s pretty damn accurate. And I go, so what’s relevant. 

First principle of quantum physics: consciousness is creating your life experiences.

And then all of a sudden I say that and they go, Oh yeah, that sounds great. But guess what? My consciousness wants to be successful. And I go, when you were using your conscious mind, but the moment you were thinking, which is 95% of the day, your program is run by your subconscious. It’s not run by you. But can you see your own behavior?

And I go, no. Why not? I said, where’s your attention when your subconscious is playing some, you know, autopilot, where’s your attention? Inside! So that means you didn’t see outside? No. So then you didn’t see the behavior that you were expressing while you were thinking? No. I can tell you the behavior you we’re expressing is whatever the program you got, you were playing a program.

Okay. So the relevance about this is we perceive we are victims. Why? I wanted to be successful. It didn’t happen. The universe is not helping me. And I go, let me give a story, Laura, which you probably heard a hundred times, but maybe some people haven’t because I’ve been using it for 30 years because it’s the best and most profound story for what we’re talking about.

Point. You have a friend, you know, your friend’s behavior very, very well. And you happen to know your friend’s parent. And one day you see your friend has the same behavior as their parent, which really excites you. You’re really wanting to tell him: Hey Bill, you’re just like your dad! And I said back away from Bill. The moment you say that Bill is going to go “How could you compare me to my dad! I’m nothing like my dad!”  and most everybody laughs because they’ve had that experience.

I go. Most profound story point. Everybody else can see that Bill behaves like his dad who doesn’t see it? Bill. Where did he get the behavior? He downloaded that was a program. He observed his father, downloaded that behavior. Why is he playing it? Because he’s not paying attention. Therefore, when he, uh, behaving like his father, everyone else can see it.

That’s his outward behavior. Does Bill see it? No, because Bill is not paying attention. He’s not looking out the window and I go, Oh my God. And I say, why is it relevant? We are all Bill. Every one of us is doing this every day. 

Laura Dawn: Then Bruce, how do we put an end to the cycle? How do we, it seems like right now, you know, this, this notion is actually in this term, intergenerational trauma is actually in the mainstream right now that there’s trauma perpetuating more trauma.

So, you know, I’ve heard you talk about us being on the brink of the sixth mass extinction. So what, what needs to change? And especially speaking to, you know, the leaders and the change-makers of our time, who are holding a vision for a more harmonious chapter of human history, what should we really be paying attention to?

Like, what is the most important piece of knowledge that we can acquire to end this cycle and steer humanity ship in a better direction? 

Bruce Lipton: Oh, the first thing right away is this, your programs are limiting, they’re invisible to you. And I said, well, do you know what your programs are? That’s the first limit right there.

It’s like a, how do I know what the program is or why you were being programmed even before you were born in the last trimester pregnancy? You were (inaudible) a whole year from zero to one, your whole year from one to two, a whole year from two to three. Up to seven. Okay. Okay. What, what program did you get when you were zero?

I don’t know, I wasn’t there because consciousness didn’t even come in. Okay. What program do you get when you were one? I don’t know. I wasn’t there to not really. I don’t know about three. You might say, Oh, I can remember some things. Okay. But guess what? You’ve already had three years of, of programming and you were not there.

So if I asked you what your programs are, you’re going to say, I have no idea. I wasn’t there. Then I’m going to give you the truth. As we just said, 95% of your life is coming from the programs. So I say, why is a row? And I say, your life is a printout of your programs. Point, whatever you like that comes into your life.

It comes into your life because you have a program to support it. But, and this is the one that’s most critical, all those things that you want and desire, but you find you have to work hard and you have to sweat over and you have to put a lot of I’m working real hard, man. I’m putting in a lot. I’m putting my work in here.

I’m making it happen. Why you’re working so hard. And the answer is this. It’s not that the universe won’t give it to you. Your own program will not acknowledge it. So when you look at your life and you identify where your struggles are coming from, you have just realized programming that you had that like, bill, you didn’t say.

You only know the consequences of it. So the idea is this, you want to change your life. First. You have to look at your own program. There’s an old hippie saying. Before you go out and change the world, take care of your own backyard. Well, the idea is we want to change the world, but if my life programs are not supporting me, how the heck am I going to change the world?

Laura Dawn: Right. And this is actually interesting, Bruce, because the latest research in neuroscience is starting to show that the way that we perceive reality is actually like a projection, like we’re predictive coding machines, and that what we have in our mind, we essentially see what we believe. And I was actually able to ask a psychedelic neuroscientist, this question. And he was like, yeah, that’s, that’s fairly accurate. And so. You know, and, and I do, actually, I have had these, my own experiences going into altered states of consciousness with the aid of psychedelics and plant medicines and have been able to actually directly see my root programs. And so I think the beneficial piece here for people, and I’d also love to get into quantum field theory deeper…But that the mind affects our biology. And so how does, how does the mind affect our biology? Why is that so crucial for us to know? And, and how can we really bring that into our lives? Like really fundamentally integrate it into our lives for the better? 

Bruce Lipton: Well, the first thing we have to recognize is this, we have been missed programmed with the belief that is so invalid and so compromising.

It’s the belief that we call genetic control. It was what I was teaching medical students back years ago, it was called genetic determinism. The belief that genes control the characters of your life, your physical characters, your emotional, your behavioral characteristics. Very interestingly, uh, the public is still, you know, um, given this belief.

Well, I said, the scientists they’ve changed the belief, but that change has not come to the public. And I said, well, what’s the new change? And the new changes switching from genetics to epigenetics, they go, well, it sounds like the same damn thing!? I go I, if I say character X is under genetic control. That’s the belief statement then X there’s a gene to manifest X. 

Okay. Uh, and then, so therefore I say, well, did I pick the genes? No. If I don’t like the characters I’m expressing, can I change them? No. Uh, and then you’re told a false statement, big one, that genes turn on and off by themselves. Well, that automatically says, Oh my God, I’m a victim of my heredity. Cancer running in my family, I’m going to get it. Cardiovascular disease? I’m going to get it. Why? I got it all these gene. 

So that was the old belief of victimization. The new science is called epigenetic control. I go: what’s the difference? I say epi means above like skin is called what? Epi dermis. I said, what does it mean? below the layer of skin?

There’s a layer called dermis and above it is the skin epidermis. What does epi mean? Profound. Above. So I say this character I’m expressing is, is under epi genetic control. I go, what the heck does that mean control above the genes? Oh, what do you mean? The belief that genes turn on and off by themselves is a totally false statement.

No gene controls its own behavior. Genes are blueprints. You go into an architect’s office and she’s working on a blueprint. You’ll lean over her shoulder and you say, is your blueprint on or off? And she looking at you and go, what are you crazy? It’s a blueprint. There’s a lot of enough. I got precisely a gene is a blueprint.

No, on and off. It’s either red or it’s not red, but the reader is not the blueprint. The reader is the mind I go. So, Oh, you mean with mind I can change my genetic makeup? You can change your genetic expression. You don’t change your genes, you change your genetic expression. And that means I could come with totally healthy genes, but my mind can cause any disease. I can create cancer and all this stuff, I can create heart disease.

I can die just because I believe I’m going to die. And the fact, this is mind over genes while I’m saying epigenetics is mind over genes. I say, what’s the difference? 

Genetics. I’m a victim

Epigenetics. I’m a master. 

Why? I can change my mind. I couldn’t change my consciousness. And if that’s what’s controlling my genes and I control my biology and all of a sudden, no, you’re not a victim, you’re a master.

But if your programs in the beginning, take away your power. And then you run those programs and science reveals 95% of the day. Then your life is in a state of disempowerment, as long as you’re not staying in their conscious mind. And to give an example of that, um, every day your life could be blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And then you meet someone. You have a love experience and the next day, 24 hours later, Oh God, life is so beautiful. I’m so in love. Uh, everything is so beautiful and I go, your life sucked every day. And then 24 hours later, you got heaven on earth. And what the hell happened? Science has recognized this as falling in love.

Keeps you in a mindful state. It keeps you from thinking when you fall in love with somebody, you keep your mind present. Why should you think they’re in front of your face? You waited for them. This is not the time to go inside your head. It’s time to stay out. And I go, Oh, so when you stay mindful, you’re not playing the program.

I go again. And what happens in 24 hours of not even playing the program, you went from blah-blah-blah to heaven on earth. And what was the point? Well, heaven on earth was always here. It was your damn program that you, that kept you from going there, but you realize the moment you said, stop playing the program, how you manifested this wonderful life experience.

Well, unfortunately, 99% of the people on this planet are operating from those restricted developmental programs manifesting the program. They didn’t put the program in. Uh, by themselves, it was put into them because the mind of a child was open for seven years to do what, just download other people’s programs and make them your own.

So, uh, like the idea that cancer is running in a family, it must be genetic as totally false. They looked at what happens to kids who are adopted and go into a family where there’s cancer running in a family. The adopted child will get the same family cancer, but guess what? Adopt a child has totally different genetics and he goes, well, how the hell that happened?

The answer is, and this is really important, especially for women because I’m going to give the example, uh, that genes do not control us. There was no gene for cancer. Huh? What about the BRC? A breast cancer gene. I got that gene doesn’t cause cancer. You say that? I say. Because 50% of the women that carry the chain never got the cancer possession of the gene didn’t cause the cancer possession of the genus correlated with cancer.

What’s the cause of cancer that programming that’s how adopted child got the family cancer. They came into the family, got programmed subconscious program that was not in harmony with their life experience. And as the result, the adopted child expressed the same family cancer. No jeans. I had nothing to do with that.

And so it’s really so critical. I, they get somebody like Angelina and Joe Lee, who, who can, I’m going to use the word because people don’t want to say it. They’re going to say mastectomy. And I go, no, she mutilated herself, removed her breasts and fear. That a gene that she possessed is going to give her cancer when it turns out that gene doesn’t cause cancer, that wasn’t the problem.

The problem of cancer is bad programming, and that’s why remission of cancer is so connected with people. What changing consciousness. They didn’t change the chemistry of the body other than the brain changes that with consciousness. And so in terms of lifestyle factors though, and when you say consciousness, you know, we’re not just talking about thinking how much do you think that exercise and spending time in nature and all of these other, you know, healthy eating influences that.

This is very critical, even at this moment, more so than ever before, because of the COVID situation. What is the COVID virus that virulent? No. It’s that people are too weak. Well, we’re, we’re dealing with rampant stress right now. I mean, at all time highs, 40% of the American population has 2.7 chronic diseases, one chronic disease, 60%.

When I say, watch a problem with a chronic disease, it taxes immune system to chronic diseases. You’re almost obliterating the effectiveness of that immune system. So when the virus comes as it, the virus that is very blunt or the weakness of the patient and the answer is no, the virus turns out not the biggest variant, it’s the weakness of a patient.

And they say, well, how can I strengthen that? And the first thing is this. As you brought up, there’s a list. Number one. Eat. Well, why? Because the food you eat is making the culture medium, that nourishes yourselves. If you make lousy culture, medium, you got unhealthy cells. That’s a simple fact. Number two, take vitamins and supplements, especially vitamin C and vitamin D because these two vitamins specifically enhance the immune system’s function.

I myself like take two grams of vitamin C every day. Okay. And then I say, then number three, I go exercise. Why? Because the blood has to go through the system to what, clean out the old stuff, refreshing, put nutrients back in and encourage everything to be vital and healthy. But if you don’t exercise the stagnant nature of that, that system will actually precipitate a problem right there.

And then number four, Big conscious because when you buy into stress and this is the biggest problem on the planet. When I talked about illness, fact less than 1% of illness is connected to the genes less than 1%. And yet all of illness thought the genes did the genes did this. I got no less than 1%. I said then what causes disease? 90% stress. Why should that cause a disease? And the answer is when you perceive a stress. Now I tell, say what’s the stress and it’s not, not only a saber tooth tiger chasing you. I’ll tell you what a stress is. Anything that gets in the way of your destination relationship. Like something gets in the way that’s a stress.

It’s something gets in the way of your job. That’s a stress, something I want to go on a vacation, God, something in a way that’s a stress I say. So what’s the relevance. Very simply stress hormones. When released into the bloodstream, shut down the growth and maintenance of the body. They go, why I say, well, Stress.

Let’s go back to the ancient beginning of stress. There’s a saber tooth tiger chasing you. Oh, I said, what do you want to do you want to run away from that, that that animal is to, well, what are you going to use your pancreas or your stomach? I say, no, you’re going to use your legs and your arms and go, Oh, I see.

So why is that important? And here’s where it comes down to it. Those functions require the blood. Why? Because the blood is where the energy comes from. If you don’t provide the full. Opportunity of blood to go into your arms and legs when being chased, you’ve just compromised your survival at that moment.

So I said, well, what are the stress hormones? Do they shut down functions in the human body that are not related to escaping that tiger? And if you’re using energy for that, it has no, uh, you know, no effect on that. Tiger is wasted. Why? Because I could use that energy to run. So stress hormones shut down the growth mechanisms of the body.

And stress hormones specifically shut down the immune system. Uh, why? Well, the immune system is internal protection. I go great. But if the saber tooth tiger is chasing me, I not worried about the bacteria. All of a sudden, because of the tiger catches, made those bacteria, not my problem anymore. So the idea why should I shut down the immune system interests?

Have you ever been sick? If you’ve been sick, you recognize something. Sometimes you don’t have an energy to get out of bed. Ooh. The immune system uses a lot of energy and I go, yeah, but if you’re being chased by a tiger, I don’t need the immune system because that’s going to protect me on the inside. I need to get out of there.

So stress hormones shut down the immune system. I go effective. I go so effective. Listen, this medical doctors give patients that are going to receive an transplanted Oregon. Stress hormones before they transplant it. I say why the tra the transplanted organ is not self. If I put in a foreign organ in your body, guess what your immune system is going to do.

First thing is going to do is eliminate the foreign organ. Okay. So I say, well, then how do doctors, you know, help a patient who is going to receive a foreign organ? They give them the stress hormones, which therapeutically shut off the immune system to allow the foreign organ transplant to take. I go well, that’s the therapeutic use of stress, but on every day, stress it’s shutting down your functions of your immune system, opening you up to more disease.

And I go, and this is the particular problem in the world of COVID because the fear is much more outrageous than the very Lynch of the, of the virus itself. The fear of the virus, which being told to everybody every day in the news. Is causing them to want be stressed. Yes. And then what shut off their immune system, then what opening them up for a much more virulent case of COVID if they catch it and all of a sudden it’s like, Oh my God, stress hormones are the death of us.

Yeah. They surely aren’t. 

Laura Dawn: So I’m curious though, because like for your teachings, Bruce, I hear you very much so saying that the control is in our mind. But people like, you know, you know, Joe Dispenza, he’s, he’s a little bit more in that mind, body thinking, feeling loop that the key to transformation is actually to generate the feeling in our body of, you know, what we want to be feeling. So that’s a way to sort of…

Bruce Lipton: And let me ask you a question about that then, which part of our nervous system is going to generate that feeling. Subconscious or conscious. Conscious of the creative one. Right. Okay. 

Laura Dawn: So do you think that that’s a key into overriding the system because you’re, you’re painting in some way kind of a, like a dire picture. I mean, there’s hope, but in, in a sense though, you know, it’s like, 95% of our lives are run on automatic programs. We’re not really, uh, geared towards paying attention to those they’re run under the surface, um, that we do have control, but it’s not. Well, very easy to see what we’re doing and to change and look at humanity.

I mean, humanity is a really good example for how change is hard. 

Bruce Lipton: But change is not hard because we didn’t understand how to make change. And this is, this is the biggest problem. Uh, and my work isn’t to make it dire. My work is if you shine a light on it, you can do something about it. But if you just start off with “I’m a victim”, then you’ve just given up the whole damn thing.

Laura Dawn: Right. Okay. So maybe this is a good segue into what we can really embody in terms of the knowledge and like imprint ourselves with knowledge of a different perceptual field of awareness. And so a lot of our imprinting came within the context of Newtonian physics. So a lot of it is inherently limiting and I do feel like, and I am actually really curious if you think that this crisis point in consciousness on a certain level of the crisis that we’re witnessing on, on the face of this planet right now, is this setting the stage for a leap in consciousness in your perspective?

Bruce Lipton: 100% everything we’re seeing on this planet, whether it’s racial, religious intolerance or economic upheaval or COVID or climate change are all symptoms of a disharmony that human civilization is manifesting on this planet.

The extinction we’re facing as you brought up earlier, six mass extinction of life, five times in history there were mass extinctions, but there weren’t people here. They were due to, you know, natural events. The last one, 66 million years ago, a comet hit the Yucatan peninsula, ao big, big comet, that it upended the ecosystem.

And that’s when all the dinosaurs were here. They all died. And up to 90% of life don’t down with them. And today we’re facing the sixth mass extinction because nature is being undermined by human behavior. So when we look at the crisis, we’re not like victims, we’re the creator of that. And so you can either focus on the symptom, say, let me clean up the symptoms.

I say no, that the symptoms are an expression of something that’s wrong. And so when we see all the symptoms and especially look the Me2 situation, the black lives matter situation, the COVID situation, these are things that are trying to direct our attention to look, you’re creating this. Don’t look at the symptom.

Start with this. This is the creation part, and this is the wake up call, but it’s sort of like what medicine has done consistently is eliminate the symptoms. So we don’t experience them. I go, but the symptoms were not the problem. The symptoms are the result of a problem. So eliminating a symptom, you can eliminate cancer cells from a person.

But the cancer cells weren’t the problem because there was no gene to make them that way. They were manifest that way because of a disharmony. So if I just tell you, your cells are stupid, they gave you cancer. I’ll take out the stupid cells and you’re going to get well. Oh, that’s a, that’s a bunch of BS belief system, uh, because the simple reality was.

The cancer cells didn’t create cancer by themselves. They were a manifestation of a disharmony in the system. So you can kill all the damn cancer cells you want, but if you didn’t affect how the system was in disharmony, then you’re going to get more cancer cells. That’s the nature of it. Okay. So you’re holding the perspective that this crisis is going to be the catalyst for breakthrough for, for consciousness and for humanity, it can be the catalyst for a breakthrough we’re on a knife edge.

We’re on the edge. We lean one way or the other way. It’s going to be different. Whether we’re going to survive as a species on the planet, or get lost as a species. 

Laura Dawn: Okay. So how much is quantum physics in your perspective, leading the paradigm shift that’s happening? I know paradigm is such a cliche word at this point, but it really is actually so appropriate. It’s a worldview, you know, and that we are going from the Newtonian worldview, although it’s been a hundred years almost since. Quantum mechanics has been discovered, and we’re still trying to figure it out, but it seems like quantum field theory seems to be the most accurate at this point. So what is the most accurate?

Yeah. So what do I know about that? Maybe we could talk about that. And the interesting connection there is that psychedelics research now shows that people who work with psychedelics and plant medicines, one of the outcomes is that they feel inherently more connected to themselves, to other people, to this earth.

And that to me is a good indication of coming closer to the true nature of reality. 

Bruce Lipton: The, the idea is this, a Newtonian world says that the universe is made out of matter and energy. And the first thing it does is it removes energy as relevant to matter. So it says energy. That’s not relevant. 

Bodies made out of matter? Oh, you want to fix it the body? Put matter into it, pharmaceutical drugs. I go, that’s a belief, but I say it’s an incorrect belief because quantum physics says that that matter is an illusion. And it is an illusion because there isn’t anything that’s physical in the universe, it’s all energy. And I go, well, why is that relevant?

Because, because if you try to separate matter, you can separate this matter from this matter, and this matter. And guess what? People are matter and not persons separated from this person separated from that person separated from that tree separated from that ant.

Why? we’re all individual pieces of matter. Newtonian.

But I go into quantum physics, everything is energy, and I go, guess what? Energy has no borders, energy mixes all the time. It’s like ripples on a pond. They don’t stop when they hit the other ripple, they merge. And I say, so why is irrelevant if we stop believing in separation? And start recognizing wholeness and integration, that we are part of a system. We’re not standing outside trying. 

We are actually perceiving that we stand outside of the system and then that we can control the system. I go, that is a fallacious idea. You are the system you’re in the system. You’re connected and entangled energy-wise with every other human, every other living thing. And every other non-living thing.

Why? Because there’s no borders to energy. It’s all one. A unity. And yet we’ve created separation. Well, there’s your problem? How can you be separate there’s no, no organism lives separate from the environment. Every organism is a constituent of the environment as we are. So if I can say I’m not relative to them, but I can do anything separate from the environment.

I go, well, boy, that, uh, uh, a total false understanding of the nature of quantum mechanics and quantum mechanics, as I mentioned, is the most valid science on this planet. It was so valid. You say, well, how come it’s a hundred years? We’re still working. I go, you know what? It depends on what you want to do with the information.

When they got quantum physics, it wasn’t like, Hey, how can we fix people? It was, how can we make an atom bomb? Yeah. Within 15 years of the discovery of quantum physics, they use quantum physics to create an atom bomb. And then we created computers and rocket ships and all that, but it has to come into our human existence.

And this is what the new biologists are saying. We are not separate entities, we’re all integrated together. Your consciousness is influencing everything around you. Your consciousness influences your plants. Some people say, I can’t grow a plant, I don’t have a green thumb. I go, it’s like, you can’t grow a plant. You’re right. Your energy is not in harmony with life of that plant. And those that grow plants, their plants thrive. I go, well, what’s the difference? I say, they’re integrated with the plant. Other people. Oh, that plan is something totally separate from me. I said, absolutely not. Your consciousness influences that plant.

That’s a reality. And the significance is then to stop looking at ourselves as separate entities, competing with each other and recognize everything is a unity. But don’t you think it, it does help to even just like navigate life, to hold that as a piece. Like, I don’t want to totally throw it away and say, you know, I, to me, uh, an integrated approach would be to embody the knowing that, for practical purposes, we’re separate people and, you know, we’re we’re individuals, but that we’re individual waves of an underlying connected ocean.

And to have that integrated piece in throughout our days could be helpful for them, both of them. That’s what I said. Look, when I recognize what was my body of virtual reality. So then all of a sudden I said, well then, Oh my God, I’m influencing this whole life experience. Then all of a sudden, now I’m looking at it from my perspective as this individual looking out.

But I also look at it, “not me totally separate” because I know I’m engaging and interacting with things, even if I’m not conscious of it. All around me. So there’s a point that says, can I honor myself, but also honor my relationship to everything around me. I said, you can do both in matter of fact, you should. That’s why we’re here. We came here to experience heaven on earth. 

So that’s your personal life experience, but you’re also involved with the entire matrix. And if you want heaven on earth and, uh, perhaps a matrix, if it was more heaven-like, would be better for all of us. Oh yes, but are we creating that as a population?

I say, no. 1% might be controlling all the rest of us and the education and the programming. And even like with this COVID thing, with the idea of censoring science, to say that a person’s belief is different than our conventional belief, our conventional belief or blinders, and, and all of a sudden somebody talks outside and they say, Oh, cancel sensor them.

And I go, you just ruined knowledge and science, the whole idea. There are no blinders. We have to be open to everything. The moment you say, this is the way it is the moment you just mess up because nothing is always this way. And we have to awaken. And I said, well, yeah, and this is what a psychedelic experiments show us: awakened to beyond your physical reality. 

And I remember magic mushrooms are so wonderful because they take away ego. That’s one of the main things that does, I said, what does it do when it takes away ego? It depersonalizes that you are the center and it offers the fact that you are integrated with everything around you, including the plants, the minerals and everything.

And we needed that to expand because the programming has narrowed us down. And we are bigger than that damn program, except that the program is of limitation. And I go, is this done intentionally? I go, well, let me tell you the fact that programming can control your life is only about 400 years old. The Jesuits have been telling their followers for 400 years, give me a child for the first seven years, and I will show you the man.

What they knew was “whatever program I put in, as you get older, 95% of your life is coming from that program. So I can control who you are.” And I go, they started controlling people 400 years ago. The control is even better today to control people. When you see an infant walking around with an iPad, he can hardly walk and he’s carrying an iPad around.

It’s like, well, that’s some serious programming folks. And the reality is we have been programmed and people have known. That programming occurs. And it’s not one of those things like, Oh, that was only 400 years ago and we don’t care. And I go, are you kidding me? Programming is much more explicit and controllable today than any time in the previous 400 years.

Are you being controlled? Are you being programmed to express your highest love and desires and wishes on this planet? I go, no, you’re not. You are programmed to be a mechanism piece in a game where you, I remember in the, in the movie, the matrix, which is I call it a documentary, uh, Neo as Morpheus. He said, what? What’s the function of a human? And then he held up a battery and he said, these are units of power, energy. And that the control of the system is to use our energy to manifest whatever they want. 

And the wake up call is now it’s time to use your battery to create your world, but you have to let go of their program to create your world and, and knowing that program or manifesting or understanding it, uh, as a major part of a psychedelic development in a child who reaches an age where this is now information, you are not a victim.

You are a spirit as much as anything in the world is. And you are powerful and until the program narrows and takes away that power

Laura Dawn: And one of the powerful experiences of psychedelics and what research is showing is that they shift our trait personality called openness, and they allow us to become more open. And so it’s interesting to hear you continuously say this like “narrowing, narrowing” and what psychedelics actually do backed by science now, that we understand is they bring a greater sense of openness. Open-mindedness, open to new experiences, which I think is so, such a crux part of the experience, but I’m really curious to ask you, let’s just say, you know, we have Joe who’s 28 years old. He’s just come into the awareness that certain programs are running his life.

He has 95% of his programs running his life, 5% consciousness. And he’s like, I need to change this belief. What do you recommend? 

Bruce Lipton: Well, the first thing is let’s recognize that as science, as quantum physics says the mind is what is controlling this. And I go, the mind sounds like there’s a single thing. I go, well, that’s the first mistake.

The mind has two interdependent elements and therefore, if you grouped them together, you’ve got a misunderstanding. I say the two elements are the conscious mind versus the subconscious mind. The conscious mind is the latest evolution of, uh, of the nervous system expressed, especially in humans. Uh, and I say, what’s the difference?

I say, they have different function. And most importantly, they learn in different ways and that’s where the problem comes from. So let’s first identify what the functions are. 

The conscious mind connected directly to your spirituality. Your source is unique to you. No two people share conscious mind. Okay. That’s you okay. It’s creative. It’s expression is wishes and desires. That’s the function of the conscious mind manifests, wishes and desires. Okay. And I go, so it’s creative and that’s its function. How does it learn? The creative mind can learn. Anyway, read a book, watch this podcast, go watch a video, go to a lecture, even go.

Aha. And did you just change conscious mind? Creative.

And the other mind, the bigger part of the mind, maybe up to 90% of the mind brain itself is dedicated to subconscious. I go sub below conscious meaning behavior that doesn’t take any thinking. It’s just programming. So the subconscious mind is a database of programs.

Okay. Uh, and I go, so why, why is this relevant? Because. A program can only play whatever it is. It’s not creative a program. As a creative I learned how to do this. I pushed the button. I’m going to keep doing that over, over, over, over for the rest of my life. A lot of people blame the subconscious for all their problems

I go No, that’s a mistake right there because the subconscious is profoundly important when used correctly. So I’ll give you an example of how useful it is. Laura. When did you learn how to walk this year? Probably earlier, right? Maybe before 2? Guess what? When you live to over a hundred, you’re still going to be walking, because once that program is in there, you never have to learn it again, it’s called a habit.

Oh, the habit mind. Well, the first thing is recognizing this, the habit mind does download programs, push a button, play the program, but habit means this. It does not change readily because if a habit just changed, then it’s not a habit anymore! So the subconscious mind is resistant to change. Does that mean I have to live with it?

And I say no, but there are ways to put information into that, that if you don’t use that access, I know it’s not going to change. Okay. Uh, and I love it because we also come with this failure of a belief that says, well, I’m going to talk to myself and I’m going to talk to them and give myself a good talking to and change those programs.

And I always laugh about it because I know you’re in the conscious mind. Your identity is in the conscious mind. I say, who’s in the subconscious mind. Nobody’s standing there. It’s a machine, just like a hard drive on a computer. So you can, you have a problem on your computer and it’s not working. Right. I say, maybe go up and talk to it for awhile.

Hey, computer change that glitch that you put in there. Just change that. Wait, come on computer. I’m going to talk to you and talk to you. And I go, how much talking to the computer will it take before that computer changes? The answer is not going to change. Because that’s not how you access data in the subconscious.

So I said, well, you want to change it? Then you need to get into it in the way it learns. So I’m going to give three fundamental ways it learns. I say, how did it learn in the first seven years? The brain function was below consciousness, alpha consciousness. And the next one down theta is below consciousness.

Say theta was the character for seven years. Theta is hypnosis. Oh, you want to change the program? Get in a theta, Oh, do I need somebody to move that watch in front of me, which is what slowing my brain function down. You’re going to sleep. You’re getting drowsy. Why were they saying that? Because when you get drowsy in alpha slows down, the next zone is theta.

So if I can get you to shut down your conscious mind for a moment, there’s a period where you’re in theta and I can now put data straight in. I go, well, guess what? Every night, when you go to bed, The you, you come home from work high vibration beta, then we calmed down. So it’s called calm consciousness, alpha.

And then I say, but the moment you close your eyes and you’re disconnected, you’re alpha disconnected, but now you’re in theta. So every night when you go to bed immediately after consciousness starts to go to sleep Theta’s operators say, then what I say, put your phones on. Why? Because whatever program is playing in the earphones, conscious mind, sleeping has no idea what the hell is going on, but theta is in a state of hypnosis.

So whatever’s coming through the earphones. When you’re going to sleep self hypnosis, put in a program that you want to be true in your life compared to the struggle that you’re facing, whether it’s relationship, job, health, whatever. There are programs. Okay. That’s called self-hypnosis every night. Go to bed, put the earphones on.

You’ll hear it while you’re awake. But the moment you fall asleep, consciousness doesn’t hear it anymore. It’s now direct download subconscious. That’s how you got programs in the beginning. And that’s how I can get them again. But I say theta stops as a predominant activity around seven, but you still learn things.

You learn how to play an instrument, drive a car, do complicated things, math or whatever you learned, all these things. I said, well, how’d you learn it? Then I go phase two. Repetition. Practice. Repeat something repeated just like a standard practice. This is not a sticky note on the refrigerator.

Sticky note, I refer to as a suggestion to make it a practice. You have to repeat that statement and repeat that continuously. So I like the new age take on it called “fake it till you make it”. And I go, what does that mean? And I said, well, let’s say you have a lousy life and you want to be happy and you’re not.

I said, but you want to be happy. So I said, what are you doing? I say. All day long. Whenever there’s a moment, just say I am happy. I am happy. I go, obviously you’re not happy. You’re in the middle of crap, but you’re saying I am happy. I go, don’t worry about that. Why? It’s the repetition of saying I am happy.

I am happy. I am happy. Why it becomes a habit. And then one day you wake up and guess why you don’t have to say I’m happy. Why? Because once the program is in, you have no more work. That’s a beautiful part about reprogramming. Since it’s operating 95% of the day without you being involved. Once you put the right program and you can have the most successful life without any more effort it’s already creating.

Laura Dawn: And so how much do you think the body involved in the process of repetition is necessary? 

Bruce Lipton: Every way you can bring in data at the same time through any sensory process enhances the download of that data. So you have an idea. And I said, well, you can think about this. Yeah. But you could also write it down and then you could see pictures of it, you know, a montage, a picture.

So, and I go that’s bringing it in visually, writing it is bringing it in a different form. Feeling it, seeing it, touching it, smelling it, everything that you can do that enhances that input. We’ll enhance the download faster. Okay. But the requirement, it’s still a time. You have to repeat it. It’s called habituation.

Okay. So that’s number two in the natural way. Now, number three is something brand new, and this is so critical because as we’ve talked about a little earlier, the world is facing a very dangerous situation here called the mass extinction. So there, how much time do we have? I got mass extinctions, not a million thousand, even a hundred years from now. Mass extinction is within this century. So we need to change because human behavior is creating it. So we need to change behavior. And guess what? Necessity, the mother of invention says, we have the necessity to learn and change as fast as we can. So a whole new modality of psychology has come in called energy psychology.

And I say, what is energy psychology? I said, it enhances what is called super learning. What the hell is super learning? I say, maybe you’ve seen somebody read a book by moving their finger down the page. As fast as they move that finger down the page, they read every word on that page. They can stand in a bookstore in five minutes, turn the page of a book, turn page turn the page, turn the page and read every page.

That fast. Read the entire book and get out in five minutes. I go, that’s super learning. I say, if you can engage that super learning and a belief change. Then all of a sudden it says that time that it took, how many repetitions I had to do the earphones at night. How many repetitions I had to say during the day, I’m happy. I’m happy. 

I go, you can change beliefs in minutes. And this is very critical because we need to change as fast as we can because the current consciousness is precipitating the extinction. We have to step out. Okay. And so then it’s important to recognize that there are a variety of techniques that are, that can do this on my website

Very simple. Bruce lipton.com under resources as a list of 25 or more belief change modalities called energy psychology. They all have different protocols, but they all activate the super learning and whatever one feels like. 

That’s the one that sounds good to me. Try that one. Because when you understand the process, you can actually change the belief in minutes, walk away a different person using energy psychology compared to the time for, uh, self-hypnosis earphones or repetition to habituation. Those are time-consuming energy. Psychology man is a miracle. Because it opens up the subconscious window and says, come on, man, download right now. Boom. And it goes in.  

Laura Dawn: Uh hum. and an integrated approach where, you know, we’re using all of these different modalities. And I personally definitely think that psychedelic healing is also a different modality and, um, 

Bruce Lipton: I like that one myself, because it’s true! Uh, and because I didn’t know anything, it wasn’t that I did psychedelics when I was a kid, my first psychedelics was when I was a professor in a medical school. Uh, from that perspective it’s very different than if I was taking it as a younger person, because now when I did it, it’s like, and it opened up the awareness, the integration of the knowledge I had accumulated a separate-like facts, became one. It was like, Oh my God, the bigger picture! Uh, so, uh, am I a proponent? Of course I am. Why? I wouldn’t be here today doing what I’m doing, if it wasn’t for a psychedelics. Okay. And it’s important. Why? Because I was locked in a programmed mind of a scientist, which is programmed. Okay. But I expanded my horizon when I left the blinders off and saw, Oh my God, there’s a bigger picture going on in here.

And who am I in this picture? Am I a victim? And the reality is no, I’m not. I’m a creator. And then to find quantum physics on one side and epigenetics on the other side, both saying the exact same thing, our consciousness is manifesting this. Change your consciousness and you change your reality. And this is like, Ooh, there’s a new age.

I go, no, no. 75 years science has recognized something called the placebo effect. I go, what is it? It’s like, Oh, person’s got some particular disease. And the doctor, our newest medicine, just our greatest research. This is the thing that’s going to heal. You, you take the medicine, you get better and you say the medicine healed me, but you find out it was a sugar pill.

Well what the hell healed you? Not the pill, the belief and the pill, a positive belief and everybody. Oh yeah. Placebo effect. I can heal you from any disease. I go, yeah, absolutely. It can change in consciousness, but then as I mentioned, If you leave out the nocebo effect, which is the negative thinking you’ve misunderstood the program and placebo positive, nocebo negative thinking influence on life is an established, scientific reality.

Okay. And it basically says healing or illness. It was not based on the genes. It was based on the consciousness. And when we understand that as a reality, then there’s a choice. You’re a human, you have a choice. Do you want to keep that consciousness? You want to change your consciousness? Ah, those that make the effort to want to change their consciousness, empower themselves.

Those that just fall in line. That’s just the way life is. It’s like, well, I’m sorry. Then that’s just the way life is for you, but not for us. And so the most powerful thing is to recognize I am more than this biological mechanism. I am a creator. Yes, we are all creators. And then the massive creation is what we express as culture.

I go, you want to change culture, then you have to change the thinking behind it. And we’re being forced at this time by nature. To awaken to the fact that look at what your consciousness is doing on this planet. Do you want this one? Well, if you maintain it, your time span on this planet is very short and here’s the opportunity to wake up. 

And psychedelics to me are great. Why? Because it’s one of the most rapid forms of awakening. You know, you have, uh, uh, it’s an amplifier, which people should know that it’s an amplifier. And I say, why? Because if you’re not in a good place, it’s probably not a good idea to take us like a deli. Cause it’s going to amplify that negative thing for you.

So it’s good vibes. You take it with a reality I am a pioneer, I’m going out to create and all that. That’s really important, but it is how fast a trip can change your entire life. And that is a very powerful thing. Is it negative? Well, only to those people that want to control your life. 

Laura Dawn: Well, I mean, it’s interesting because I have really applied a lot of what I’ve learned from you directly into my psychedelic experiences, which I feel like being in that hyper malleable state, uh, has rapidly amplified my healing process of really making peace and forgiving myself and having more acceptance for who I am and healing some of my past traumas, because I’ve been able to understand the conceptual framework of how the programming works. And so I think so much of it is intention. 

The outcome of the psychedelic experience is so influenced by set and setting. And so for me, your teachings are actually part of the set, which is referred to mindset. So I go into the psychedelic experience with a lot of these teachings as part of my mindset. And I think that that’s actually a huge key.

Bruce Lipton: I think it’s a major key, because there’s an intention and it’s not just, Hey, show me something. It’s like, why, who, what, where am I going, asking a question and then getting an answer from a bigger source than the one that’s just between your ears, because you get out of this and then you become part of the field and the answers are in the field.

Not necessarily in your head until they are downloaded from the field into your head. So intuition. It was really opening up to say, there’s, there’s a database of knowledge that I can tap into beyond me. 

Laura Dawn: I’m like so excited to actually share this with you Bruce. There’s two really interesting things that I wanted to share with you.

And one of them was that, um, I met a shaman from Columbia. Uh, actually he was from Ecuador. And I listened to him give a talk. It was translated. And he, you know, he lives in just deep shamanic community. He’s not, you know, reading books on physics or quantum physics. And he was saying almost word for word quotes, that Einstein said that the field is the sole governing agency of the particle, you know?

And he, and so in his talk, he said, you have to go into the spirit realm and create there. And then that manifests in your reality. That’s what shows up. And it was just like, Oh my God. And I feel like I’ve learned so much about, you know, quantum field theory and quantum physics from the medicine first and foremost, you know, psychedelic experiences. 

And then I would go and do research and learn about it. But then to meet this shaman, who’s just, you know, living in his community and then saying things like that, that are so resonant with what, you know, Einstein and other people have said about understanding that we are connected to this field. And that’s actually the governing agency of what’s manifest in this 3D reality, which allows us to be a conduit, a channel for creating from those realms and manifesting that through our beings into this reality. So we’re, we’re naturally creative beings here to create.

Bruce Lipton: Heaven on earth! And that’s the beautiful part because I said, what if you went and took a survey of every human on this planet and said, what do you want? The answers for perhaps 90% or more be the exact same answers, happy, healthy, being loved, have a job to do something creative and all this. Right. And I go, Jesus, if 97% of the people have the same wishes and desires, why do we have this?

And the answer is because we’re not operating from wishes and desires. We’re operating from the programs of those people who knew we were programmable for 400 years. And, uh, and that’s how you decide, how does somebody get more power? And I go, people don’t get more power. They just take away the power from the other people.

So they look like they got more power, but everyone has the same power. Except if you don’t believe that, then as soon as that, now you are controllable and this is how, uh, a small percentage of people have put their wishes onto the planet, manifesting their wishes, which is antagonistic to the massive number of people on this planet that have no, no desire to do Wars and killing and all that kind of stuff like that.

They just all want to be happy and in love. So then how common I said, because programming. Get that kid before age seven, teach them what you want. And then that kid will become a voice of everything. 

Laura Dawn: Hmm. So that’s a huge message for parents. No pressure. 

Bruce Lipton: Well, the idea is difficult and I want to say why, because, now we’re going to wait, you know, there are people that already woke to the conscious nature of parenting, conscious parenting, meaning you’re interaction with your child is being programmed by that child. Your good traits are being downloaded and your bad traits are being downloaded. And the problem is, while I said, well, what’s being conscious.

I say, well, that’s about 5% of the day. So I’m going to be a conscious parent. I go. And how much of the day it’s not going to work? I got about 5%. I say, so why is it relevant? A conscious parents still has 95% of the life coming from the program. They download it from their family. And this is why illnesses, diseases, and capacities run in family lineages.

It’s not because of the genetics. That’s what we always said, which made you a victim. It’s because of the programming, which gives you, when aware of the programming gives you the opportunity to manifest the life you want. And I can tell you right now, like yourself and myself, my life is wonderful. I have a different life.

Uh, once I started to take the science and this was the hard part, because I first went out to the science was an academic awareness, conscious mind. I was so excited about it. It’s like, Oh my God, if you understand the science, you can create then a fabulous life. So I grab a bunch of people, try to put them in a room and say, let me tell you about this science.

You could create the most fabulous life. And they look at me and go lifting for a guy who says, you know, this stuff, your, your life doesn’t look that fabulous. And it was a wake up call. And this is a wake up call we all have to have. And I said, what was the wake up call? I almost said, thank God I didn’t sayl do as I say, not as I do.

And I realized, Oh my God, how can I talk about this? But I’m not living it. And I said, no more lecturing. I either make this a way of life or I don’t lecture on this. And the beautiful part was, how long did it take me to get it into a way of life if a day or so? Because all I had to do was focus on stop following the program.

And all of a sudden things started to manifest and there was a point that, well, now I can change this and I can change that. And now I live where? I live heaven on earth. That’s my life. I love my life. I love this planet. I love my relationships with people around me and the people around me are living a happy life.

Why? Because if I’m in the middle of their happy life, I was also happy as well. And so the opportunity is if we all changed and started to become the happy people, uh, the, the planet will change instantaneously. It’s an instantaneous change cause it’s not a physical change. It’s a consciousness change.

Laura Dawn: Hmm, and another really interesting dot that I’ve been connecting, you know, I, uh, lead transformational retreats, I bring your teachings into these retreats and we also go into altered states of consciousness in these retreats. And, uh, one thing that I find is really interesting, especially when you start talking about hypnosis and data brainwaves, um, is that, especially in psychedelic experiences, on a visual level experience, very highly ordered patterns. There’s this like, you know, I have this experience every time I drink ayahuasca, you know, it’s like, Third eye, it’s like right in the center part of my inner field of vision. And it’s highly ordered. Like, I mean, you can’t even describe it, really words don’t do it justice calling it a fractal is just not even what it is. But to me, and even when I look at like Shipibo cultures, they’re tapping into a frequency, they’re tapping into a frequency and another dimension, and they’re channeling that through their very specific artwork and this links to this notion of hypnosis and also links to cymatics; what we understand about frequencies and healing, and that when we start going into very high frequency energies, that those patterns become more coherent, more organized. And so I’m just noticing some of those, those dots that I’m connecting, but maybe you could just tell us what cymatics is and what that has taught you in your life.

Bruce Lipton: Oh the cymatics experiments? Well, let me, even before you go to that, let me just tell you something. We also know then that is this artists and scientists do not operate in this realm. They go to a higher realm, bring in ah, ideas from that realm and translate them into this realm. So the important part of the creative nature of science and artists is that it’s done not on this plane.

You have to let go off this plane and go into the bigger fields. So that’s really important. But so cymatics is a wonderful study because it reveals the Einstein quote that you just talked about. You said the field is the sole governing agency of a particle. Uh, and I go, so what is it, and I say, well, cymatics is, uh, like a, a drum with a tight skin on the drum.

And you sprinkled grains on it, whether it’s sand grains or powder grains or something. So they just got them spread on the drum. But when you play a vibration, the drum, the skin vibrates with the sound. And I said, so what? And I said, well, the skin is going up and down like this, with this, with the vibration.

I say, so what, so if I put a, a grain of sand here and my, it lifts up, it’s going to knock the grain of sand, but there are parts of the, uh, of the vibration when we’ve talked about vibrations, like up and down, like signwaves wave stuff. Well, there’s high parts where it pushes the sand up. But there are parts of the vibration, the low part where there’s no vibration at all.

So I said, then what happens? I say, you put evenly spread all the granules on this thing, play a vibration where the high parts of the sound, the field are high. They knock the grains up, but if they land in a low part, they, they don’t move again. So all of a sudden it says you started with an even distribution, but at some point the ones flipping up and the ones that don’t move, generate patterns.

And these patterns are beautiful. But the interesting part is if you change the vibrational frequency, the pattern changes as well. So all of a sudden it says you can more from this pattern to this pattern, this pattern by just frequency, change the frequency, a little higher, a little lower, and it depends on how much the sand is being bounced around and all that.

So basically what does it reveal? It reveals the exact point that the energy field gave the shape to the granules that are on that drum skin after you play the frequency. Another way of looking at it thats even, you know, more common for people to understand is you take a piece of iron, a file, you file the iron down, you get a pile of iron dust called iron filings.

And I say, you put those iron filings in a salt shaker. And you have a piece of paper. And I say, sprinkle, the iron filings on a piece of paper and there’s a random pile, just iron filings, random, random, random. I go, okay. Now the next time before you sprinkle the iron, finally, you put a magnet underneath the piece of paper, and now when you sprinkle the iron, finally, it’s not random anymore.

It makes an elaborate picture of what it’s called the magnetic field. There’s a pattern. And every time you throw away those filings and sprinkler, again, you get the same pattern again. So I say, what’s the difference with no field? Matter is random, but when there’s a field, the pattern is impressed into the particles.

So the particles are giving shape and I say, is the shape controlled by the particle? I say, no, it has nothing to do with that. The shape is controlled by the field, which is causing the particles to, to, to move into a pattern this way. And so I go, so that’s the most important understanding matter. Plus field equals pattern matter with no field.

No pattern. And then I show people this, you know, pictures of the iron filings, and all that, and this beautiful elaborate array of the magnetic field. And I also go look at this. I say, instead of seeing these as iron filings, consider these as cancer cells, you’re looking at a tumor, an organization of these cells.

I go, where did that cancer come from? I say, Not the cells. It came from the field that shaped them. And so why was this important? Because the original belief, Oh no, uh, cancer is built into the cells with uncle James and I go, no. That doesn’t form cancer. It’s the field that will take those cells and put a pattern into them, the field governs that.

Hmm. Okay. And then I go, yeah, but your consciousness is a field generator. I said, how do you know? I said, well, you put wires on your head and then I can show you the electrical activity of your consciousness. Like, Oh yeah, my thoughts are in my head. And then I go, guess what? There’s a new device called Magnetoencephalography.

Not electroencephalograph I say what’s different? Electroencephalogram wires on your head, direct conductivity from the brain. Magnetoencephalography, the probe is out here and I’m reading your brain function. I go, you must understand the most important meaning of the Magnetoencephalography.

Your thoughts are not contained in your head. You are a field generator. The field shapes matter up right back to quantum physics consciousness, the field. This is manifesting your reality. Exactly the same thing. And so that’s really important, really important. 

Laura Dawn: One just, you know, for people listening, you know, just to kind of tie it all together.

When I’m in these, the really deep states in the psychedelic experience, I feel like I am being entranced by the, the, the  patterns that I feel like are permeating my entire consciousness. And so it’s those moments it’s like moving through the eye of the needle where I really go in and I feel like I have root access to my subconscious mind and I lay down, I consciously lay down an new imprint. And I can see it visually.

It’s so interesting. And what we now know about biophotons, I’ll really focus my mind and my body, I can, I can with my mind and the help of plants, I can really focus on radiating light from all of my cells and get into a much more coherent state. And it’s those experiences that I have found incredibly transformational. 

And I’ll have my eye mask on and my noise-canceling headphones with music that is carrying a frequency, a specific frequency in the music. And I feel like it is the sort of root access for me. 

Bruce Lipton: Cymatics! Cymatics is what you’re creating a field to shape your world and the beautiful part about psychedelics, having done them myself, is once you learn the experiences you carry that experience with you forever after. So it’s not that I have to do psychedelics every day or week to be there.

It’s like once I’ve experienced it and I’ve touched it, I know what it is now. I can do it myself. But I couldn’t do it without the help of that chemistry. Which, you know, because if I had to do it myself as a kid, I, how would I do this? I, there was no way of learning that. But as I said, even these psychedelics are used in cultures all over the world to introduce a child just growing into a more adulthood, is at that interface. Okay. Have this experience. Because this experience will reveal to you that yes, you live in a physical world as this physical entity, but there’s a bigger world that you’re involved with and you cannot see without these elements. And that’s a beautiful part. Uh, and as you talked about what what’s unique about it and an interest is this: perceptions take in information.

And, uh, all this Huxley, a famous writer who, who wrote the doors of perception. Okay. 

Laura Dawn: Influenced by his psychedelic experiences. 

Bruce Lipton: That’s right. He did mushrooms that somebody, he wasn’t going to do it on his own, but he was encouraged by peers to say, you’re a philosopher, you’ re aware of all these things, you should do this. And at least report on it. And he did it. And of course he reported on it. It changed his whole life and he realized something and very important: A child when it’s born, the perceptions are wide open. I say, so what does that mean? It’s like overwhelming the amount of information coming in.

Yeah. I mean, it’s like, Oh, like that. No, no control. That to get control, the human biology will then narrow the doors so that it’s not overwhelming information coming in. We now have narrowed, narrowed the doors down to small, so we can deal with things because if too much is coming in, it’s like, we can’t do anything.

But a psychedelic opened some doors, but they were always there. But to conform to life, we narrow those doors just so we can control our life better. Okay. And yeah, that world was always out there. Whether you took the psychedelics or not. But if your doors are narrow, you cannot see that world. And that’s why the doors open up.

And this is, uh, why, the most important part of the psychedelics says, yeah, the normal day to day life you’re looking through a little tiny hole looking at the universe or this little tiny hole, but with psychedelics wholeness shows up. 

Laura Dawn: It’s leverage to think bigger. 

Bruce Lipton: Absolutely 

Laura Dawn: And that comes back to the personality trait, openness, that we open our minds, we think bigger.

And in psychedelic research, and Michael Pollan wrote about this in his book, “How to Change Your Mind” he refers to it as lantern consciousness. What you’re talking about open wide open versus spotlight consciousness. And as we get older, We tend to narrow. And one of the effects of that, that I like, that we’ve kind of sprinkled throughout this conversation is creativity.

And that’s actually, I’m back in graduate school, I’m studying creativity studies and change leadership, and I’m looking at the role that psychedelics can influence in terms of helping us to think more creatively. And, um, just to sort of tie a loose thread there. Um, you mentioned scientists and artists, and I want to expand that to really give everyone permission, to know that, you know, we can all tap into these other dimensions and create from those places and that we’re all, we all have the capacity to create.

And I do think that plant medicines and psychedelics are one of those bridges into, you know, the field into these other dimensions of reality that we can create from. 

Bruce Lipton: Oh, absolutely. I agree with that. It was just that the difference between if my career is based on science, where am I going to get my answers for it?

My career is an auto mechanic. I go in the shop and I got an auto mechanic. I don’t have to go out of my head. It’s right here in my face. But as a scientist, I’m trying to pull in something that doesn’t exist. I have to go somewhere else to get it as an artist. I’m going to create a, uh, something, but it’s not here.

I have to go there. So you’re right. Um, those two professions specialize in that because that’s where the data has to come from, because it’s not like an auto mechanic with parts on the table. Okay. But as you’re right, and the most important part was, everyone can do this. And if everyone did this, then that, that consciousness creates art.

That consciousness that creates science is available to everyone. Uh, and if you don’t do it, you’re only gonna, you know, express your program at that particular time. So, um, as required, and that’s why nature is giving us this chance. It says you want to survive on this planet. Well, dammit, you better change your consciousness right away because your narrow consciousness is the most destructive thing on this planet causing an extinction and that you want to change the extinction.

Don’t change the world. Change your consciousness and then the world will change. 

Laura Dawn: Right. I really just wanted to add that in there because I think this is the key for, you know, really allowing and inspiring, really more people to give themselves permission, to know that they’re empowered to create. And I think that’s one of my core messages of my life is really just inspiring people to know that.

And. Um, and so in, just in closing, I’d love to just invite you any sort of parting wisdom for the leaders, the Changemakers, the creators. And I really see the creatives and the creators as being at the forefront of, you know, leadership and, uh, You know, this community of change-makers. And so, um, what would you say, you know, just in, in parting advice to, to our generation. And we all have the responsibility right now to drastically shift the way that we’re showing up. And so anything that you would just love to say in closing is most welcome. 

Bruce Lipton: Basically, look, we’re looking at a world that’s facing a lot of profound problems of, uh, ending our, our existence as biological entities on this planet. And I say, and how are we going to get out of this?

And he said, well, the answers are in here. And Einstein said, you cannot solve the problems with the same level of thinking that created the problems. If you stay in the box, all you have is the same thinking that the box has created. You have to get out of the box, but to get out of the box, you have to take your consciousness from the program, and separate it from that program, so it’s not restrained by the thinking of conventional box.

And that, uh, psychedelic experiences are one of the most rapid and effective ways, but you have to be prepared. Don’t do it as we talked about, uh, in a negative sense because it’s not going to really be that helpful. But if you go with a quest, you go with an intention, you go with a purpose into this other world, the surprising answers that will come and be the answers that we required to survive. The answers are not even here now.

So everybody who goes out on that quest brings something back into this world that can help us change this box. Get out of the limitations that were causing. And, uh, and so then I can only close personally with very simple fact. I have a life today that I’m what 76 or something and I was around 50, I really put my life into what it is I’m teaching. 

And I want this and I have to admit, and happily so, that I went from life of conventional stress, struggle, struggled, doing work and all that stuff into this life where every day I wake up and I go: I’m the luckiest person on the world to be here to experience as the joy, to surround myself with people of a similar consciousness, because collectively each of us broadcasting with the magnetoencephalography, our thoughts, each person is a tuning fork.

And the more people that are tuned into a different vibration collectively manifest a power. A single tuning fork may not make a difference, but a hundred, a thousand, 10,000 tuning forks all with the same vibration manifests reality. And so what am I finding? I’m finding all the people around me that are around me because of what we’re all talking about.

Collectively, are the happiest, healthiest, most wonderful people. And so I only have one suggestion and it’s like, if you’re not there, you can get there because this is why we were here. Uh, and if you leave this planet without recognizing you are in heaven, but you conform to the box. Hell, uh, I’m sorry, because it’s time for us to say get your power because heaven is here for all of us. But it’s only for those that can think in that direction and create in that direction.

If I’m just a program, then I will become whatever the program says. And I said, that’s where the problem comes from. You are more. Then this program, and I know you, and our common friend, Annie, who works for us. I’m so happy because she’s of this consciousness, and you’re of this consciousness, and this is why my work community is so happy because everyone around here is coming from this higher level of consciousness.

And they had to activate it. It didn’t happen by sitting in a classroom and then, boom, I change. I go, no, this is the classroom, now get out of it and bring stuff back in! 

And so I want to appreciate all your effort and helping everybody because that is the only way out of the crisis we are now facing. 

Laura Dawn: thank you so much. It’s so powerful. And really I’m just tuning into where Inspiration wants to take me and that’s, that seems to be my key in terms of figuring out how to be in my own heaven on earth is where… what’s stirring within me, that’s inspiring me to move and take action. That notion of inspiration; “in-spiritedness” is, is that direct line that I feel like, you know, nurturing that connection from the Spirit realm into this realm. 

So thank you. And I just want to say, you know, Bruce, I was not expecting you to talk about your own personal experiences with psychedelics. So openly. Have you talked about this anywhere else before? 

Bruce Lipton: Not generally in public, because if you go out in the general public and they have a program bias that says, Oh, you’re a drug game.

And then it’s like, well, then they lost the value of everything I was talking about because they put a, a filter in the front that says, I’m not talking to you because you did a druggie thing. And that’s what the conventional world is. And I say, why would they put that up? And the answer is because if you go out here, where we’ve been, you become empowered.

But if I prevent you from coming out here, then you’re a programmable element. And the, the main media, the main government, the main control is “I need to control you”. If you get too big in your head, I can’t control you anymore. Hey, but guess what things are changing, Oregon just opened up and legalized mushrooms and every damn thing up there.

And it says, this is a sign of the future because it’s a younger people and their belief system, when that becomes government. And I’ve seen it. Look, I grew up when, when pot was the most illegal thing in the whole world, and now I’m living in a state where, Hey, you can go down to the store and buy candy or pot.

You can pick it, whatever one you want to make yourself happy. This is a world change. And the more this opens up, the more power it gives. And the whole idea was to disempower you. And yet this is antagonistic because what we’re talking about is empowerment, right? I was curious actually how much you’ve been tracking the movement, the psychedelic space, and that if you were also feeling more aware that psychedelics are now, you know, being backed by valid science and that they are supporting backed by spot, they were backed by valid science, 30, 40 years ago.

But yeah. It was the system, as I said, the system does not want you to be aware to this level, because as, uh, as I said, Tony Benn member farming, governments do not want a healthy, intelligent population. If you become too intelligent, they can’t control you. And so they’ve done everything and their world to compress us. And keep us from experiencing this planet the way we should, because it’s a manipulation and I’m so totally against it. 

Laura Dawn: Wow. And so this is kind of like your, your coming out podcast that you are, that you are pro psychedelic movement. It’s actually kind of amazing. How do you feel about this being shared?

Bruce Lipton: Well, at least this community can understand me now. If I went down to the street and talk to some fundamentalists, they’d probably boot me out of the damn place, but Hey, Yeah. If people are here, they’ve already got some indication. And I just want them to know before we close. Yeah. This is the right direction.

This is the most important thing of freedom. You’ve got to get out of the box that we have all been programmed to be in, because the answers inside this box are creating the mess that’s here. 

Laura Dawn: Right. And we have to think differently, at a higher level than the thought process that created the problems in the first place.

And I do think that psychedelics are that bridge to help us think bigger, to help us think more creatively.

Bruce Lipton: I agree.

Laura Dawn: That’s amazing. Um, I’m actually just so amazed. I’ll have to retract what I said that, you know, Bruce Lipton is not advocating the use of psychedelics and not that you are, but that you’re really advocating the, the power to make a choice about how we can affect our own consciousness. Like as a sovereign being, I have the right to affect my own state of consciousness in whatever way that I want and for a government to be included and involved in that thought process to me is like, outrageous and ridiculous, 

Bruce Lipton: It’s the manipulation of human rights. That’s it. And I am happy to be in my own world and not theirs. 

Laura Dawn: Yeah. Right, right. That’s amazing. Thank you so much, Bruce. Dr. Bruce Lipton. Wow. You are just such a, a real pleasure to talk to, and I just feel such a genuine sense of kindness and warmth from you. And I’m grateful for people like you on this planet right now.

Bruce Lipton: So thank you so much. And thank you for having an opportunity to spread our collective message. To more and more people because everyone that wakes up as another tuning fork to add their power to the creation that we all want. And so thank you very much lower for letting me be here with you. Thank you.

Laura Dawn: Wow. Miracles, birthing more miracles. Awakening of humanity. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you so very much.

Bruce Lipton


Bruce H. Lipton, Ph.D., cell biologist and lecturer, is an internationally recognized leader in bridging science and spirit. Bruce was on the faculty of the University of Wisconsin’s School of Medicine and later performed groundbreaking stem cell research at Stanford University. He is the bestselling author of The Biology of Belief, The Honeymoon Effect, and co- author with Steve Bhaerman of Spontaneous Evolution. Bruce received the 2009 prestigious Goi Peace Award (Japan) in honor of his scientific contribution to world harmony. For more information visit www.brucelipton.com

Featured Music

Episode #7 of the Psychedelic Leadership Podcast features a song called
“Dreams”  by Ksenia Luki


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About Laura Dawn

Through her signature Mastermind Programs and Plant Medicine Retreats, Laura Dawn weaves together science with ancient wisdom. She teaches business and thought-leaders, entrepreneurs, and creative professionals how to mindfully explore psychedelics and sacred plant medicines as powerful visionary tools for inner transformation, fostering emotional resiliency and unlocking new depths to our creative potential.